I met a fellow traveler of Adam's today at my hangar.

As all of us know Adam started this thread because he loves Avanti's though he doesn't own one. I met Gerald Luton today who loves them passionately though he isn't even a pilot.

Here's the backstory:

My friend Jeff Sandusky, who is Midwest Sales Director for Cirrus Aircraft, and I hadn't seen each other for quite a while and met for breakfast early last winter to catch up. During breakfast he mentioned he had a friend, Gerald Luton, who was a passionate fan of Piaggio's. He wondered if the next time I was going to Dallas, or some other short hop, if I would give Gerald a ride in my plane and he'd fly his Cirrus to pick him up and bring him home. Of course I would.

A couple of weeks later we had a trip to Addison and though I wasn't making that flight Gerald did. He had the cabin to himself and Mike Denton who was flying gave him a complete tour. Gerald was thrilled and I got a nice follow up thank you from him the next week.

About a month ago Gerald reached out and said he had something for me and wanted to meet. Today we met at my hangar and Gerald, who lives just south of the airport, was sporting an Avantair hat and a big box. He's been a big fan of Piaggios for many years and knows more about them than anyone I've met that hasn't been to Flight Safety yet.
He told me that he tracks all the Piaggio's that fly into or out of Wiley Post and loves to come outside when he hears my airplane taking off or landing.

What was in the big box was a beautiful FDM model of my plane! As we unboxed it he told me "you just have no idea how much that flight meant to me".

Who does that? I mean has an expensive, custom, model of your plane made for you because you brought them along on a short flight? Someone who, though he never had the money or opportunity to become a pilot, loves aviation and has a passionate spot in his heart for what he thinks is the coolest airplane ever: the Piaggio Avanti. He kept telling me how blessed he was but I'm the one filled with gratitude.

We had a great visit for over an hour and I'm determined that the first Avanti flight won't be his last. He's willing to fly in a Waco too and so we're going to make that happen soon.

Those of us who regularly break the bonds of earth at the controls of an airplane often take it for granted. I know I don't often have the same sense of wonder and excitement that I felt as a boy climbing up the aisle of a DC 3 these days. Gerald does!

P180 tires… I sent my tire back for retread, and they sent me an exchange. But I just noticed they sent back a different part number. I sent in Michelin 028-357-0 and they sent back 021-357-1. These are the same size but the 028 version is 190mph rated and the 021 version is 160mph rated.

I will call and get the right thing coming… But it got me wondering what, if anything, is the actual difference? Physical? Just approval? Anyone know?

Idk about airplane tires specifically but in the car world, higher speed rated tires have additional nylon belts so that the tire will hold its shape at higher speeds. Think about it this way, centrifugal force is always trying to force the tire outwards. With no belts at all the spinning tire would look like this <> as the center would be forced outwards. The belts make sure the tire stays like this [ ] but with higher speeds you need more belts to hold that shape.

Idk about airplane tires specifically but in the car world, higher speed rated tires have additional nylon belts so that the tire will hold its shape at higher speeds. Think about it this way, centrifugal force is always trying to force the tire outwards. With no belts at all the spinning tire would look like this <> as the center would be forced outwards. The belts make sure the tire stays like this [ ] but with higher speeds you need more belts to hold that shape.

Thanks Chris, that makes sense. Do you know how that relates to the Ply rating? In this case they are both 12 ply rated.

They show they are both 12-ply, but the spec sheet shows 1lb difference. 17lbs vs 18lbs ?

Thanks Chris, that makes sense. Do you know how that relates to the Ply rating? In this case they are both 12 ply rated.

You do update it for tread wear, right? Your tires are always getting lighter over time.

Mike C.

I update it with the same frequency you do.

Fun question Jon - is the 160mph compliant w the POH. I went through this exercise a while back.

Well… I don’t think so.

The equipment list in Ch. 6 W&B lists (only) the 028-357 p/n. And the parts manual also lists that. Gives a Goodyear tire p/n 265k08 as alternate, which is also a 190mph tire.

The flaps mid landing speed is listed in Supplement 36 as 132 KIAS at max landing weight. 132 KIAS at 10000 feet (the max landing altitude in Limitations section) is 153 KTAS which is 176 mph. This is above the 160 mph tire limit. Further, certain landing emergencies (no flap, single engine) list Vref speeds of 20kias over the flaps mid speed.

So, I think the 190 mph tire is probably required. How’d I do?

edit: Just noticed section 2.18.6 of limitations says max tire speed is 154 KTS. As I basically just derived above…

So...would one of you happen to have a PDF copy of the Avanti POH just to read and dream about?

Well… I don’t think so.

The equipment list in Ch. 6 W&B lists (only) the 028-357 p/n. And the parts manual also lists that. Gives a Goodyear tire p/n 265k08 as alternate, which is also a 190mph tire.

The flaps mid landing speed is listed in Supplement 36 as 132 KIAS at max landing weight. 132 KIAS at 10000 feet (the max landing altitude in Limitations section) is 153 KTAS which is 176 mph. This is above the 160 mph tire limit. Further, certain landing emergencies (no flap, single engine) list Vref speeds of 20kias over the flaps mid speed.

So, I think the 190 mph tire is probably required. How’d I do?

edit: Just noticed section 2.18.6 of limitations says max tire speed is 154 KTS. As I basically just derived above…

I’m getting retreads that are the 190 version… I already have one and they are swapping the 160 they sent, no questions asked. Desser.

I suspect it has more to do with them just viewing it as a 6.50-10 tire and they send whichever they have unless you are very specific.