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 Post subject: NexGen USAF Air Combat Sim?
PostPosted: 30 Jun 2017, 17:04 
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Joined: 12/22/07
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Company: Midwest Chemtrails, LLC
Location: KPTK (SE Michigan)
Aircraft: C205
I've had a few chances to fly F-16 sims (stationary base) inside projection domes. The Kraken Disorientation Research Device looks like a LOT more fun. Put me IN, Coach!

[youtube]https://youtu.be/2vLKSmFKbKA[/youtube]

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 Post subject: Re: NexGen USAF Air Combat Sim?
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2017, 12:42 
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Joined: 08/12/10
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I've watched the video 3 times now and am amazed that within that $19mm budget, the best visuals they could produce are still well below what a 7 year old has on his gaming computer.

Why would it be so bad?


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 Post subject: Re: NexGen USAF Air Combat Sim?
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2017, 18:29 
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Joined: 06/28/14
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Location: Pleasanton , TX (KPEZ)
Aircraft: 1963 Bonanza P35
looks fun i hope the 19m included the building or something seems high to me but it is the govt...


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 Post subject: Re: NexGen USAF Air Combat Sim?
PostPosted: 03 Jul 2017, 08:25 
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Joined: 08/23/11
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Company: Delta/ check o'the month club
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Doesn't look like the graphics are there for realism, rather just something for reference. The graphics in our real sims are better - still not as good as video games, but much better than this.

I've done a lot of work with Boeing over the years to make our simulators better. What I've found is that increased resolution graphics are the least bang for the buck. Depending on your mission set, the graphics may not be all that important. In air to air simulator training, we're primarily looking/practicing the long range radar/sensor stuff so you don't spend that much time looking "outside" anyway. You'd be amazed at what commercial companies (Boeing used X-Plane) charge for government use of already developed and fielded software. And we wonder why the F-35 is over budget... (sorry, different soapbox)


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 Post subject: Re: NexGen USAF Air Combat Sim?
PostPosted: 10 Jul 2017, 18:19 
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Joined: 03/11/08
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Aircraft: PA28-161
I often read that simulators for ACM training have come a long way. Count me among the skeptics. It seems to me the cost to create a realistic, all aspect visual environment and add in the maneuvering sensations, if doable, would be better spent on fuel and airplanes. Just my $0.02.


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 Post subject: Re: NexGen USAF Air Combat Sim?
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2017, 17:36 
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The typical fighter costs ~$30k/hour ... the sim is likely going to be a LOT cheaper. That does not include training range costs.

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 Post subject: Re: NexGen USAF Air Combat Sim?
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2017, 18:22 
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I'm all for cheaper fighters, at least until UCAS gets established. :)

Picture yourself straining to look over the top of your ejection seat, trying to keep your adversary in sight at the limits of your peripheral vision, aircraft is nose up and inverted, you're hanging in the straps, waiting for the bogey to wash out under you before you pounce. Wings are about to stall, you're feeling it hanging by a thread, DON"T TOUCH THOSE LATERAL CONTROLS, waiting, waiting, can you keep it flying for two more seconds.....?

Tell me how much it costs to develop and operate a simulator that can do that? If you could. If all you need is a mockup to practice throwing switches, fine but that isn't what we're talking about here. Anything less and I'd rather have a cockpit mockup in an F-5 and go fly some engagements on the ACMR.


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 Post subject: Re: NexGen USAF Air Combat Sim?
PostPosted: 30 Aug 2017, 08:35 
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Company: Delta/ check o'the month club
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Username Protected wrote:
I often read that simulators for ACM training have come a long way. Count me among the skeptics. It seems to me the cost to create a realistic, all aspect visual environment and add in the maneuvering sensations, if doable, would be better spent on fuel and airplanes. Just my $0.02.


Yep!

Some things just can't be simulated; and other things can't be done in live fly training. For the sim we try to concentrate on the stuff we don't get in live-fly. Massively outnumbered scenarios are the primary ones for us air-to-air guys, as well as large or very advanced MEZs (surface to air engagement zones for SAMs) . We just don't have the jets or the money to go fly 8 v 20 everyday, but we can do it in the sim. We also don't like to shut down engines, have fires/leaks/flight control problems/system failures on a regular basis in the real jet so sims really shine there as well.

Visual maneuvering is as much about feel and G's as it is about what you see. Until we have a sim that really puts those forces on your body, you'll get more negative transfer than positive training from the sim.


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 Post subject: Re: NexGen USAF Air Combat Sim?
PostPosted: 30 Aug 2017, 12:39 
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Joined: 08/01/16
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Location: Chicago suburbs
Aircraft: Working on it...
When I was living in Virginia I did a little flight instruction on the side. The chief pilot was a retired A6 driver and he got the instructors a little time in the carrier landing sim. That is hard to do. On my first attempt as I got close to touchdown I flared and up I went. This little voice comes over the headset "we do not flare in the Navy". Try number 2 was successful, try number 3 went sideways right at touchdown and I got a big red X. Not sure if I died or just crashed.

One of the guys I checked out in a 172 was an F14 pilot. He was cool and worked it out so we could play with the combat sim. They took an F14 front end and put it in this golf ball room. They had 2 linked together so they could run intercepts and stuff. We didn't have any missiles but we did chase each other and I'm proud to say I lived for 4 1/2 minutes before he killed me. Just so you know, "I'm gonna hit the brakes he'll fly right by"....... doesn't work. Just sayin'. The last "dogfight" I was able to hit him with 61 bullets. I was so worn out.

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