Speedbrakes are a nice tool to have in the bag when descents become non-standard. If ATC holds you up, speedbrakes will help you come down on shorter notice. When descending on your own navigation, it's good to perfect your power management so you don't need to deploy anything until you're ready for approach flaps.

Based on all the pretty lady pictures from the IceMan I don't believe he even knows where the speed brake lever is or how to use it. No matter what's on the Video

So pictures or it didn't happen unless you are the iceman and then it didn't happen regardless of pictures. Nice! tough crowd.

I have to chime in here. I was flying home this weekend on a 737 (American, not private). I was *dead* asleep, and the pilot pops the speedbrakes, hard.. (I'm sure you can tell me if there are settings.. if there are, it had to be close to max.. i felt an intentional heavy slowing sensation..)

I woke up out of a dead sleep and yelled, and I kid you not, throttle back - you threw a fan blade..

Speed brakes on the 737 are rough.. And I scared the crap out of the FC cabin.. It vibrated the whole plane.. A lot..

How dainty.

With a turboprop, thoughts of acting low class never enter your mind because you are already there.

Mike C.

How dainty.

With a turboprop, thoughts of acting low class never enter your mind because you are already there.

Mike C.

Yeah and you have to buy first round at the bar too...

Andrew

Sometimes speed brakes aren't an option. Citations in icing conditions require 75 percent N2 to keep things warm, and coming downhill it may be the only way to slow down or make a speed restriction !

...not sure what this means, but it kinda feels like all of us non-jet-owners were just insulted.

For anyone that feels speed brakes are a bit disruptive, they should experience deploying the inboard reversers on a DC-8. (in-flight).

I'm not so sure Mike. In the KA, I can deftly round out and gently plant one wheel at a time on the runway; in the Citation we have what's called the 'working landing', Don't want to round out too much and float too far down the runway, so, we may plant the landing. The KA has such a large rudder, it makes it very well mannered in crosswinds and can even make average pilots look good. Citation: not so much. Of course Beta in the KA is awesome. Our Citation has TRs, but many don't. There's a place for each in my mind. I don't think I'll ever tire of the C90 even though I also like the Citation II (but I'm a old infantry guy and either is step up and a class act in my mind.)

Ah, you've never landed a MU-2. I think every landing is somewhere in the category you're calling "working landing". Short body Mits has the CG a little too far forward of the main wheels, which makes it tend to come down fairly solidly on the nose wheel after the mains touch. It's not dangerous, and with real technique and attention it can be mitigated, but it's certainly not an easy landing on a consistent basis.

That said... Home base is a 2600' runway, and I never roll to the end. My hangar row is at the 2100' intersection, so I usually use that without brakes. If I work at it a little I can make the 1600' intersection. And once or twice I've made the 1200' high speed exit. So... Yep. Sometimes props have advantages.

Jon...I recall seeing Citations at KSQL. They still fly in and ou of there?

Yes, there are some in and out occasionally. One CJ4 is based here. I see the older straight wing Citations some, and the CJ series some. Not many other jets though. A couple Eclipses were based here, but I know one went off the end of the runway and I heard through the grapevine that one (same one? not sure) smoked a set of tires.

And some are in the next category, whatever that is called.

The MU2 is absolutely not ambiguous about the transition between air and ground and vice versa. You will never wonder which you are.


For 2600 ft runway, 0 MSL, 15C (ISA), zero wind:

Citation V can land at 13,750 lbs (90.5% of max landing weight).

MU-2 M can land at 8,100 lbs (81.4% of max landing weight).

Note that both distances assume crossing runway end at 50 ft AGL. That eats up about 1000 ft of runway before touchdown. Putting the plane on the numbers can save about 800 ft of landing distance.

Now make the runway wet, and the jet can't land at any reasonable weight. Meanwhile I will (and have) landed on solid ice in the MU2.

The jet pilot is going to spend a lot more of their time on researching runway conditions.

Mike C.