Jet+Chute=Homerun Sales. All the rest is irrelevant. There are many, many folks flying to the Hamptons from NYC every weekend who will buy this plane in a heartbeat.
Jet to HTO makes no sense at all, you could probably beat one in a 172, but you wouldn't believe how many there are.
I feel like I'm listening to people talking about how Apple is terrible and predicting the imminent implosion.

My take on his argument is primarily fuel efficiency. That jets are not suited for a FL250 limitation. I don't see that problem for the SETP's. They are all certified more or less to where METP's go. Yes you have oddballs like the Avanti and Cheyenne 400 (TU95?) that get into jet territory. But most turboprops run well in the 20s - just like the PC12, TBM and Meridian.

There are zero civilian jets that run in the 20's on purpose.

Very true.

Tim

Great thread guys... Very interesting.

Once again,a citation x, not a slow 400 sp jet.

You gotta be kidding.

Phenom 300, CJ, Pilatus Jet, SF50 etc. are single pilot jets that are much slower than a Gulfstream at FL410. So they get in the way. C'mon man. You referencing $50MM jets flown by a crew is totally inaccurate. You should delete that post. It's misleading. The thread is about the SF50 and at the very least "owner flown, SP jets". Don't bring a Delta 737 into the mix. That's silly.

Park a new Pilatus next to a 30 year old, $100K Citation and the girls will gravitate to the Citation. This phenomenon is why VLJ's exist and why the SF50 will sell big. Everyone wants a jet.[/quote]

I remember seeing a pic of Jason's Pilatus filled with gorgeous woman. I just assumed they appreciated the utility of the Pilatus. Right???

I disagree on being the X vs something else. The sky is full of speed bumps up at 410 now. The phenom 300 goes right up there too. Have to go to 450 now for open airspace.
I just think too many Atlanta controllers are on this board and see all JCs posts, and mess with him.

You can't get a block to FL290 because its in RVSM airspace.

Having RVSM, if there was traffic at FL300, an aircraft could get a block FL280-290. A non RVSM could not because there would have to be 2000' of separation from the FL300 traffic.

You can't get a block to FL290 because its in RVSM airspace.

Having RVSM, if there was traffic at FL300, an aircraft could get a block FL280-290. A non RVSM could not because there would have to be 2000' of separation from the FL300 traffic.

I in the camp where I think the SF50's economics and operational limits don't make a lot of sense, which ultimately will greatly limit its appeal (and subsequent sales).

That said, there's one thing it has going for it that I think is underappreciated, and that's its geometry - the thing isn't a whole lot bigger than a 182 or other piston single. It'll fit in a lot of hangars, and won't require a lot of complex or unusual towing or handling equipment. For a personal airplane those things matter because it makes it easier to take into a small airport without an FBO or whatnot. So at that level I think there are some possibilities.

But it's definitely weight/range/size limited, especially for the money. The operating economics will have to be pretty darn good to make it advantageous versus buying a used turboprop that'll do a fair amount more. For me, owning a $2M asset that can't do things I would want is a serious bummer. Telling my friends I can't take them on that trip to Vegas or whatever (try sitting in the thing, it's a 4 person airplane unless the #5 and #6 are very small) is up there on the bummer list, that's the kind of thing that makes owning a personal airplane fun.

What are the crazy stats people post? Something around 80% of the business flights are 1-2 people only? For an owner flown plane, like the PA46 line, it will mostly be the pilot and maybe one or two guests.

Tim

Get a helicopter!

My answer is a tbone. Makes perfect sense to me!

Btw the runway requirements for the sf50 are pretty damn good.

Once again,a citation x, not a slow 400 sp jet.