I'm am contemplating Dry Leasing a Cessna 414A, for 50-100 hours on an as available basis.

Meaning, I would use the plane only when it was available.

Dry Leasing means I am responsible for fuel and oil.

What would be a fair lease rate for a block of 50-100 hours to be used over 1-2 years?

How do you calculate that lease rate?

How does such an arrangement work if something breaks on your watch? Not necessarily an accident, but I'd be curious as to that and also the insurance.

W John,

I'll let you know after I see the lease.

Good Evening Frank,

Just as a point of information the "dry" part of a dry lease, has nothing to do with fuel and oil. A dry lease means that you are providing the necessary crew for the operation of the aircraft, not the lessor. Typically these leases do not include consumables, such as fuel & oil; however, that is not the defining feature which makes them a dry lease, and it is possible to have a dry lease which does include fuel & oil in its hourly rate.

Just clarifying this because it is a widely misunderstood concept (as well it should be - don't ask me who came up with the whole dry vs wet terminology, but they should have their head examined). I've heard this called incorrectly out a number of times, including times where the person making the statement was actually the lessor. It's just a poor choice of words, but for now we're stuck with them.

As you noted, the lease should spell out the terms for maintenance and insurance requirements, but typically you would want to be added to the policy as at least an additional insured and as a named pilot, even if you meet the existing OPW. Typically the premium increase for adding the dry lease coverage to the policy as well as any increase brought about by adding you as a named pilot would be passed on to you as the lessee.

Maintenance issues traditionally remain the responsibility of the lessor.

John IV

414's generally charter at $750

Take out fuel ($200) and pilot ($50) and $500 seems reasonable. Maybe $400 in 50hr blocks

I'd agree with that Charles. I would NEVER lease a 414 on either side of the deal. Guaranteed cylinder work and mechanics blaming operator. PBaron motors on a 421 airframe. Jmho

Yeah, that's the sort of stuff that came to my mind.

Suppose it could all be sorted.

But the proposed 400 buck plus gas seems like a lot of money to to do 175kts.

You're not paying for speed you're paying to bring 5 grown men and their shotguns and two cases of beer and somewhere to put used beer.

Also, the $200/hr (40gal/hr) gives you 200kts...plus what Charles Robertson said.

You're not paying for speed you're paying to bring 5 grown men and their shotguns and two cases of beer and somewhere to put used beer.

Ok, three widows and four orphans and enough wheat to last them through winter. You get the idea.

Not true at all. What's the single engine ceiling on PBaron at gross? 13,000FT? A 414A will stay put at 20,000 on one engine at gross which is 500lb higher than PBaron. That should tell you something about that wing. 414A wing is not the same wing as 421C wing. With 335hp upgrade and winglets, it's an amazing single engine performer, probably the best piston twin ever built. There is a reason why 414A commands such high prices.

I'm familiar. The wing can make some numbers on paper. What it doesn't do is allow those engines, in those cowls, to run cool temps up high while dragging around that much weight/airframe. A quick review of the historical engine logs will enlighten a prospective 414 owner.

I'm familiar. The wing can make some numbers on paper. What it doesn't do is allow those engines, in those cowls, to run cool temps up high while dragging around that much weight/airframe. A quick review of the historical engine logs will enlighten a prospective 414 owner.

My 421C had 8,000hrs of engines going to TBO. I did run under 65%, but the prior owner ran multiple sets of engines to TBO at 75%. 225-230kts at FL250 every flight. The chts run 350ish at 75%. My PBaron ran 65% in the 20s with temps under 380.

The 414a (s) I flew (didn't own) couldn't climb well when hot/heavy without burning up CHTs. This is out of Phx. A lot of time was spent on those planes trying to make the engines run cooler. No joy. One was sold, and the other is getting 12 jugs as I write this.