BeechTalk - BT

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Mar 2022, 17:04

Username Protected wrote:

Well, I don't know how to edit my original post, but maybe the topic should read: Best plane for 4 people, 600nm. It seems that 5-6 people is a tipping point that drives a massive step change in costs.

I think my original intent exceeds my finances. One option for us is simply to limit who travels GA. I can have junior staff fly commercial as necessary. If we cut this down to a 4-seater mission, with all else staying the same, does this simply become an SR-22 or DA-62 thread?

Vic

I think what I have observed is that if you want to fly 4 people, comfortably (with respect to fuel, baggage, weather, space, reserves, etc) the right plane probably has 6 seats

If you want to fly 6 people, the right plane will probably have 8 or more seats

etc...

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Mar 2022, 18:03

Username Protected wrote:

I think what I have observed is that if you want to fly 4 people, comfortably (with respect to fuel, baggage, weather, space, reserves, etc) the right plane probably has 6 seats

If you want to fly 6 people, the right plane will probably have 8 or more seats

etc...

It’s a good recursive rule until the airlines attempt it and routinely confuse the minus sign. They buy a 114 seater and shoe-horn 149 into it. :doh:

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Mar 2022, 19:45

Your original post seemed to be looking for a Twin. If you're considering singles without a lav, I think that opens up some other options. 210, Caravan, TBM, PC-12, Kodiak, etc.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Mar 2022, 22:58

Username Protected wrote:

I think what I have observed is that if you want to fly 4 people, comfortably (with respect to fuel, baggage, weather, space, reserves, etc) the right plane probably has 6 seats

If you want to fly 6 people, the right plane will probably have 8 or more seats

etc...

I've said many times the number of people that can *comfortably* travel cross country in a airplane ins n-2, where n is the number of seats.

This rule applies equally well to two-seaters.

(And yes, I've crossed the US in a 2 seater.)

Username Protected · **Posted:** 15 Mar 2022, 08:33

You won’t go wrong with an sr22 or a36

Lots of them made
Pax like them
Easy to resell

But something you can afford and see what use you can get out of it

And you can use a cirrus for 4 people/200nm

Username Protected · **Posted:** 15 Mar 2022, 20:25

Username Protected wrote:

You won’t go wrong with an sr22 or a36

Lots of them made
Pax like them
Easy to resell

But something you can afford and see what use you can get out of it

And you can use a cirrus for 4 people/200nm

I’ve done 5 hour legs in the cirrus but agree that it’s a bit much. 2-2.5 hours isn’t bad for 4 adults. Call it 350-400 nm no wind.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 15 Mar 2022, 21:46

Username Protected wrote:

I really need to stress passenger comfort. For this to work, the 4/5 passengers should feel they are riding in something more akin to a limo than a farm tractor - while not breaking my monthly operating budget. Is this too much to ask?

Vic.

You have just described a King Air, and there is a reason they are more expensive than Mu2 or a 421/414

Username Protected · **Posted:** 15 Mar 2022, 21:53

Username Protected wrote:

If the passengers are squirrelly and use google, forget the Mu-2. Not fair, but not worth the hassle either.

Charles, I think that applies to ALL general aviation aircraft. The press is never kind to us.

Example: CHARLES...DO YOU KNOW THAT YOU'RE MOST LIKELY TO DIE IN A CESSNA?!?!?!?!?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 16 Mar 2022, 03:33

Username Protected wrote:

Your original post seemed to be looking for a Twin. If you're considering singles without a lav, I think that opens up some other options. 210, Caravan, TBM, PC-12, Kodiak, etc.

PC-12 has a lav. Some TBM's have a lav.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 16 Mar 2022, 03:50

Username Protected wrote:

Regarding the chart, if the interpretation is made that people are more likely to die in a Cessna, why are Beech more expensive to insure than Cessna?

More expensive people?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 16 Mar 2022, 07:44

58 Baron

Username Protected · **Posted:** 16 Mar 2022, 19:28

Why in the world are we assuming the OP needs or wants only one airplane? Clearly this is a mission for a CE501 augmented with an G36 for shorter/lighter missions. Similar price points.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 16 Mar 2022, 21:34

Username Protected wrote:

441 if you can find one. 330ktas at 500lbs/hr. Very comfortable for 6 people

Meets the "limo" description to a T, but I have not seen a 441 that will actually do 330 knots, at least ours will not. Most do have a hard sliding door that more or less closes and a flushing toilet.

I view a 441 as basically a B200 with the roof smashed down 6 inches, which apart from the obviously lower headroom also gets you where you want to go faster and on less fuel and with greater range. But when you are sitting down it's a very luxurious 6 seater and economical to boot. An oversimplification, but from a passenger standpoint that's the practicalities of it. Ramp appeal is no contest in favor of the King Air, if that is important.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 17 Mar 2022, 09:19

Username Protected wrote:

Your original post seemed to be looking for a Twin. If you're considering singles without a lav, I think that opens up some other options. 210, Caravan, TBM, PC-12, Kodiak, etc.

PC-12 has a lav. Some TBM's have a lav.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 17 Mar 2022, 09:22

Username Protected wrote:

Why in the world are we assuming the OP needs or wants only one airplane? Clearly this is a mission for a CE501 augmented with an G36 for shorter/lighter missions. Similar price points.

The folks who bought my Twin Beech are using it for the short range mission highlighted here. Part 91 flight department using jets for long flights and the 18 for 300 miles or less. Word from them is the employee passengers love it.

Best plane for 6 people, 600 nm