BeechTalk - BT

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 15:32

Username Protected wrote:

+1

A second airmen qualified in the airplane is the best safety component money can buy. There is a reason ALL airlines have two pilots. When we start talking about a guy who is successful enough to buy a fast airplane, he is probably running a business... it's hard to be both a focused pilot and a focused businessman.

Many years ago the VP of the company I worked for at the time and myself sat down with our President / CEO, the subject... we wanted him to stop piloting his own airplane. In the previous week another successful entrepreneur had killed himself in a plane crash, to his credit he saw the wisdom and hired a pilot. That allowed him to move past the Baron, into a Citation... a few airplanes later he owns a CJ4. Could he fly it? You bet, the guy is a natural pilot... does he? No. He rides in the back and has two pro pilots up front.

Each individual in this situation has to make there own decision, but if there's a question... get a pilot to fly with you.

So what's your explanation when 2 pro pilots crash an airplane?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 15:43

Username Protected wrote:

+1

A second airmen qualified in the airplane is the best safety component money can buy. There is a reason ALL airlines have two pilots. When we start talking about a guy who is successful enough to buy a fast airplane, he is probably running a business... it's hard to be both a focused pilot and a focused businessman.

Many years ago the VP of the company I worked for at the time and myself sat down with our President / CEO, the subject... we wanted him to stop piloting his own airplane. In the previous week another successful entrepreneur had killed himself in a plane crash, to his credit he saw the wisdom and hired a pilot. That allowed him to move past the Baron, into a Citation... a few airplanes later he owns a CJ4. Could he fly it? You bet, the guy is a natural pilot... does he? No. He rides in the back and has two pro pilots up front.

Each individual in this situation has to make there own decision, but if there's a question... get a pilot to fly with you.

So what's your explanation when 2 pro pilots crash an airplane?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 15:45

Username Protected wrote:

The same as when a twin crashes: Sometimes,things just don't go your way..

I just don't know where this concept came from that 2 pilot airplanes are crash proof. Seems they crash plenty to me.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 15:48

Username Protected wrote:

The same as when a twin crashes: Sometimes,things just don't go your way..

I just don't know where this concept came from that 2 pilot airplanes are crash proof. Seems they crash plenty to me.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 15:53

Username Protected wrote:

The same as when a twin crashes: Sometimes,things just don't go your way..

I just don't know where this concept came from that 2 pilot airplanes are crash proof. Seems they crash plenty to me.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 16:00

Username Protected wrote:

If you're by yourself and have an emergency, who opens the POH to the emergency procedures section?

In the Pilatus, there's not much to go wrong. There's no section in the POH for "wing falls off" or "fuel tanks explode". An emergency in the Pilatus would be the engine quitting. There are only a couple things one can do to get it going again and I have that memorized. If it doesn't start again, you land.

In a 1985 Gulfstream I'm sure the list of possible emergencies and possible fixes is 1000 pages long.

I don't believe I can be convinced that I'm safer sitting in the back of an old 2 pilot jet than flying my own Phenom for example.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 16:02

Username Protected wrote:

Who claimed anything is crash proof? Two experienced pilots who are checking each other put the odds more in your favor, but nothing is infallible.

Chip's story implied "crash proof".

Do you have any numbers to back up "odds in my favor"?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 16:35

Username Protected wrote:

Who claimed anything is crash proof? Two experienced pilots who are checking each other put the odds more in your favor, but nothing is infallible.

Chip's story implied "crash proof".

Do you have any numbers to back up "odds in my favor"?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 16:36

Username Protected wrote:

Who claimed anything is crash proof? Two experienced pilots who are checking each other put the odds more in your favor, but nothing is infallible.

Chip's story implied "crash proof".

Do you have any numbers to back up "odds in my favor"?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 16:39

Username Protected wrote:

That was the Royal "your." I have no idea what "your" odds are, but if the SHTF I'd bet you would rather have another skilled person with you. I hope you are never put to that test, of course.

That really wasn't the story. The story was "sit in the back while 2 other guys fly the airplane".

Like I wrote above..... I'm not flying the Space Shuttle.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 16:57

Username Protected wrote:

If you're by yourself and have an emergency, who opens the POH to the emergency procedures section?

In the Pilatus, there's not much to go wrong. There's no section in the POH for "wing falls off" or "fuel tanks explode". An emergency in the Pilatus would be the engine quitting. There are only a couple things one can do to get it going again and I have that memorized. If it doesn't start again, you land.

In a 1985 Gulfstream I'm sure the list of possible emergencies and possible fixes is 1000 pages long.

I don't believe I can be convinced that I'm safer sitting in the back of an old 2 pilot jet than flying my own Phenom for example.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 16:58

Jason, you don't know what you don't know.

There is absolutely no argument that can be made that a trained 2 pilot crew is no more safe than a single pilot operator.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 17:00

to be fair there is a lot that can happen other than an engine quitting. Fire, explosive decompression, fuel leaks, electrical problems, cargo or passenger issues. I can recall a lot of times that one of us got out of a seat to go attend to some problem, that was unrelated to an engine failure. If you've never chased down and secured a loose pig in the back of an antonov, you should try it.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 17:01

Username Protected wrote:

That was the Royal "your." I have no idea what "your" odds are, but if the SHTF I'd bet you would rather have another skilled person with you. I hope you are never put to that test, of course.

That really wasn't the story. The story was "sit in the back while 2 other guys fly the airplane".

Like I wrote above..... I'm not flying the Space Shuttle.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Jul 2017, 17:02

Username Protected wrote:

Jason, you don't know what you don't know.

There is absolutely no argument that can be made that a trained 2 pilot crew is no more safe than a single pilot operator.

If 2 pro pilot flown airplanes never crashed I'd agree with you. But it happens all the time. I think you guys need to go read Crash Talk. There are too many variables for you to make such a statement.

What plane am I describing?