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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2016, 14:03 
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T.R.
Let me know if you ever need someone right seat....
for real.


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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2016, 16:29 
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Old post, but I've flown most of the lears. Exception is the 40 series. I've flown the Citiation II's, V's. The Citations will have a little bit more friendly cabin for the pax. However.........when the weather gets ugly such turbulence and icy, Lear everyday. If you loose an engine after V1, I'd still take the Lear as it climbs on one better than the Citation on two. How do you make a Lear climb like a Citation.........shut one down. :lol:

35's and 31's are great airplanes. 31a has modest amount of glass cockpit.

35/36 have big range. 31 not so much, but will still go 1000+ nm with typical winds.

These airplanes are not for faint of heart to maintain though, and with Fuel flows that are in the 200 gph neighborhood delivering .76-.78 numbers.

31a will go straight to FL 410 at gross weight on standard+ days, and likes between FL410 and FL 450

If you really want to be impressed check out the Lear 60. This is the one that leaves a perma grin on your face! Sea level to FL410 on standard day in less than 13 minutes. Second and 3rd hour fuel flows that resemble the 31a. the LR60's shortcoming is it's brakes. Same as the 30 series but weighs 5000lbs more. Kinda turns the LR60 into a 5000' runway airplane. It can use less, you just can take as much with you.


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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2016, 16:44 
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Username Protected wrote:
I never go anywhere without my bride and since she is a pilot.....


Me too. Hard to adjust to, but single pilot issue, is a non issue.

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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2016, 23:03 
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T.R., your post is planting some seeds of ridiculous plans for me. That's pretty amazing performance for the $.


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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2016, 23:24 
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Not to reopen the single pilot v. Non-single pilot debate, which I've heard both sides of multiple times here...
But I'd think the financial cost of a copilot would be rounding error in the context of flying a Lear.
Edit: assuming you don't marry her. :)


Last edited on 21 Jan 2016, 02:30, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2016, 23:36 
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Username Protected wrote:
But I'd think the financial cost of a copilot would be rounding error in the context of flying a Lear.

Probably not for T.R.! :D

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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2016, 23:39 
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Username Protected wrote:
Not to reopen the single pilot v. Non-single pilot debate, which I've heard both sides of multiple times here...
But I'd think the financial cost of a copilot would be rounding error in the context of flying a Lear.

I don't avoid it to save $$. I avoid it because I don't want to haul someone around I don't want around. It's just another failure waiting to happen for me.

I have buddies with 2 pilot jets. They never send the pilot home. They put him up in a hotel and bring him to dinner every night.


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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2016, 23:43 
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Username Protected wrote:
Not to reopen the single pilot v. Non-single pilot debate, which I've heard both sides of multiple times here...
But I'd think the financial cost of a copilot would be rounding error in the context of flying a Lear.

I don't avoid it to save $$. I avoid it because I don't want to haul someone around I don't want around. It's just another failure waiting to happen for me.

I have buddies with 2 pilot jets. They never send the pilot home. They put him up in a hotel and bring him to dinner every night.

My buddies with two pilot jets sit in the back. And wonder why I fly around in little planes.

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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2016, 23:47 
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Username Protected wrote:

I have buddies with 2 pilot jets. They never send the pilot home. They put him up in a hotel and bring him to dinner every night.


When I had a pilot working for me, I was off the jet before the engines were spooled down (even when I was flying it). He shut it down and buttoned it up, made all arrangements with the FBO, etc. I wouldn't hear or see from him during my trips at all. When I was ready to leave, whether it was 2 days early or 2 days late, I would send a text message to him. When I showed up at the airport, he had the plane fueled, bill paid, flight plan filed, clearance picked up, bar stocked, and was starting engine # 1 as I closed the door. Sometimes I miss that when I'm doing it all myself! :D

I wouldn't hire any employee that I had to babysit. That applies to all aspects of my life and businesses.

Come on Crandall, you know all this ...

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Last edited on 20 Jan 2016, 23:49, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2016, 23:48 
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Username Protected wrote:
Not to reopen the single pilot v. Non-single pilot debate, which I've heard both sides of multiple times here...
But I'd think the financial cost of a copilot would be rounding error in the context of flying a Lear.

I don't avoid it to save $$. I avoid it because I don't want to haul someone around I don't want around. It's just another failure waiting to happen for me.

I have buddies with 2 pilot jets. They never send the pilot home. They put him up in a hotel and bring him to dinner every night.

Jason you need a friend that's a pilot. Then you have your built in SIC.
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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 21 Jan 2016, 09:42 
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Username Protected wrote:
When I was ready to leave, whether it was 2 days early or 2 days late, I would send a text message to him. When I showed up at the airport, he had the plane fueled, bill paid, flight plan filed, clearance picked up, bar stocked, and was starting engine # 1 as I closed the door

Poor form. He shoulda been starting #2 to keep the noise down while the door was coming shut. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 21 Jan 2016, 10:37 
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For you guys who don't mind 2 pilot aircraft - may I silently put a spectator's vote in for the underdog, the ugly duckling, the contender, the kid from the wrong side of the track: the IAI Westwind II!

Can be had for a third of a Learjet ($300K), has same reliable TFE731 engines and will fly 2500nm with an-almost-stand up cabin. I know of no other jet in that category that has that kind of performance-per-buck ratio.

:thumbup:

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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 21 Jan 2016, 14:37 
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Joined: 01/29/09
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Company: retired corporate mostly
Location: Chico,California KCIC/CL56
Aircraft: 1956 Champion 7EC
Being "the Help", I can tell you that corporate jobs vary a whole lot. I have been a member of the family who could not get off the boss's Hatteras, to working for an owner who wouldn't allow us on his Hatteras. ( I miss Walker's Cay some days, many days at Chub back before the hurricane blew away the hotel ) .
Usual job is to be ready to fly, and have cars etc arranged. Kill a few days in a hotel, and fly home.
One job had me catching the right front tire, at the wall during pit stops... been a gun bearer, cattle weigher and seller..and a Pawnee Brave pilot in the AM, and a Cessna Conquest pilot in the PM.


Sometimes aggravating, most times fun.. And beats the hell out of digging ditches.

Jeff (who doesn't mind being paid to fly )

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soloed in a land of Superhomers/1959 Cessna 150, retired with Proline 21/ CJ4.


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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 21 Jan 2016, 17:16 
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Username Protected wrote:
For you guys who don't mind 2 pilot aircraft - may I silently put a spectator's vote in for the underdog, the ugly duckling, the contender, the kid from the wrong side of the track: the IAI Westwind II!

Can be had for a third of a Learjet ($300K), has same reliable TFE731 engines and will fly 2500nm with an-almost-stand up cabin. I know of no other jet in that category that has that kind of performance-per-buck ratio.

But it's slow, and ugly, and boring as sin to fly. Yes, if you're all about the numbers it's a good airplane, but I'll take the Lear and a fuel stop any day ;)

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My last name rhymes with 'geese'.


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 Post subject: Re: Lear 30-series vs. Citation V/Ultra
PostPosted: 22 Jan 2016, 02:19 
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Username Protected wrote:
For you guys who don't mind 2 pilot aircraft - may I silently put a spectator's vote in for the underdog, the ugly duckling, the contender, the kid from the wrong side of the track: the IAI Westwind II!

Can be had for a third of a Learjet ($300K), has same reliable TFE731 engines and will fly 2500nm with an-almost-stand up cabin. I know of no other jet in that category that has that kind of performance-per-buck ratio.

:thumbup:

Adam-

How does the performance of the WW2 compare to the Lear 35?

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