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23 Oct 2025, 04:52 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 20 Oct 2025, 18:36 
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Joined: 11/08/12
Posts: 7612
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Location: Live in San Carlos, CA - based Hayward, CA KHWD
Aircraft: Piaggio Avanti
Username Protected wrote:
The change in MU2 numbers came in 1984, the SFAR didn't change change any of the AFM numbers from what I remember.

Ok. They were clearly lengthened at some point, as we have discussed many times.

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Maybe the P.180 has a similar bias.

I think there is a bit, especially for the higher gross weight supplement.

Operating at KHWD, I have never once not made the turn off at D landing on 28L (~2600’ from the displaced threshold). And I have to land with the props pulled back at 1800 rpm in order not to trigger the noise sensor and get a nasty gram. So it would be typically shorter with props full forward.

I have landed and taken off at KSQL a couple times to try it, once at about 11000 lbs. No drama. I probably should have taken the hangar there.

I just used KOWD this past weekend, with no discomfort, at around 11,600 lbs.

It lands quite short, particularly ground roll, without much difficulty. Takeoff can be a little flat if you ease the back pressure at rotation and let it accelerate, but if you don’t it’ll get to 50’ pretty quick.

But obviously I have not tested the acc-stop numbers.

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-Jon C.


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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 21 Oct 2025, 13:04 
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Username Protected wrote:
The FARs have formulas that don't allow you to take all the headwind advantage, and they really penalize the numbers for tailwinds, this despite the physics being effectively the same for both.

There are definitely things like this in the Piaggio materials which make no sense to me, chief among them, they put a floor on vref at 117 KIAS when we know the stall speed continues to decrease as things get lighter. I'm not sure if this is a VMC consideration or something else, but I do follow the book and put a floor at 117 KIAS even though it's obviously not 1.3x stall speed.

Also, the plane is specifically approved for 9-degree (15.8%) approaches with full flaps, which is a neat trick that you can't do in most jets. When you turn those props into flying garbage can lids and configure the plane, the speed control is incredible. At max landing weight, the plane can be descended at VREF (117-121 KIAS) at 1,850-1,920 FPM (9 degrees).


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